November - June Hand Troll?

[Super Cub]

Can I play here, too? Oops, I mean, here is my intro post along with my first series of questions for you pro-trollers.
First, here's a quick peek at my current boat (assuming I can figure out how to link a photo here)

As you can see, I have cute 22' dory named the "Super Cub." I took the name from the famous airplane because dories have similar characteristics (small, slow, but haul a lot of cargo in tough conditions). It is currently rigged for albacore (20' poles with handlines). I have the original davits, but the hydraulics were stripped by a prior owner while trying to convert this to a pleasure boat. With the doghouse and a 3/4 tote taking up all of the rear deck space, I don't think hydraulics are in my future (unless I just add tuna pullers on the rear corners). Therefore, I'm trying to figure out if there is any way I can make a living with this boat while I save for something bigger.

I have read most of the threads on this board, and I am in a little different situation than most of the other newbies that I can recall. I don't live in Alaska (yet); I don't have commercial fishing experience (other than my brief go at albacore this past summer before my engine blew), and I'm not a teenager trying to find my way in life (I'm a 40 year-old with a career displaced by the economy trying to find my way in life...). I have family in the Anchorage area, and I've considered moving there, taking an office job, and fishing recreationally out of Seward on weekends. However, after 20 years of self-employment, I'd rather find a way to build a new career fishing commercially. I have many years of boating experience (mostly on the Columbia River and bays, but I'm building my ocean experience as quickly as I can), quite a bit of boater safety education, and a passion for fishing, but I want to make sure that I'm not leaving any of you the impression that I know a thing about salmon trolling.

I would eventually like to buy a larger boat and possibly some SE Dive permits (cukes and ducks), but I don't have the bankroll that I had a few years ago, so I'm looking for a way to make trolling pay for a while. One option is to sell the dory and find a larger wooden troller here in Oregon, but our salmon seasons aren't bankable right now and albacore is tough with a slow old boat (tuna are generally 35-100 miles offshore here, so I would spend way more time running than fishing). I am obviously limited to only fishing tuna on "nice" days due to my boat's size, but I think there is a chance I can make a living from July 1 through about mid-October (crabbing in Sept / Oct if I can't fish). My big question is whether a little boat like mine and a skipper with no local knowlege has a chance of fishing safely and turning a profit hand-trolling in SE Alaska from November through mid-June?

Obviously, my main question leads to several smaller questions such as: What port would be most conducive for a beginner? Are there enough weather openings in the Winter / Spring for my little boat to be safe? Would I need to fabricate some type of a top for my boat, and would that be sufficient to save me from hypothermia? Are winter housing and moorage prices reasonable? Etc.

I know this is a lot to ask from my first post, but any input is appreciated.

[rookie]

Well i fished out of coos bay ore with a dory about that size.

[lone eagle]

good looking dory, I took mine to Port Alexander to fish many years ago. I can't imagine doing that in the winter, it was tough keeping warm and dry in the summer! Maybe the salmon will show in Oregon this summer.....

[yak2you2]

There's a lot of guys hand trolling out of skiffs your size, in Alaska, and the west coast. It can be done. I know guys who are able to feed themselves doing it, but most do it around other means of income as well. I.E., being involved in other fisheries, or halving a job to go with it.
Winter fishing out of a skiff is doable, but you WILL be cold!
There are places with protected areas to fish.Believe it or not, there are actually a few advantages to a boat your size. 1) You can fish rods up in some of the tight places that big boats can't get into, and the fish like to be sometimes. 2) Little boats are very economical, you don't have to catch many fish a day to come home with wages. 3) The simplicity allows for not much to go wrong. 4) They are easy to pull out of the water when you want to.
You have access to a computer, do some research. All the state's post their catch records and averages, as well as their seasons. This should help you decide where and when to be.
I havn't winter trolled in my skiff in years, and being a fellow 40 something, I can tell you that if I ever did it again, i'd being buying a nice Mustang work suite!
Your boat looks very well kept and seaworthy, good luck to you.

[Salty]

This might be a good place to describe my day winter Chinook fishing out of Sitka, yesterday.

Climb out of my nice comfy bed, dress in all the winter fuzzy's as it is about 28 degrees. Go out and spend twenty minutes scraping ice off of the windows of the truck. It had rained last night and then turned clear and cold, more on that nice icing later.
Drive down to the boat and step out onto the blacktop in the parking lot. Slip onto my ass. Fortunately, I still have a hold of the door and don't hurt anything too bad. Carefully navigate the black ice on the cement and dock down to the vessel. Notice that all the windows are frosted up which is weird because I have a nice little space heater that is supposed to be on. Open the door and notice space heater is not on. A little tracing and I notice the 110 plug in has shorted and melted the plug in strip.
Anyway, the stove does start up after a little fooling around and the place slowly starts to warm up. Check the engine room and all is well. Start the engine and computers. The computers start fine but my monitor and mouse don't work. Fool around with the connections for about 10 minutes and get the monitor working. Fool around another 10 minutes trying to get the wireless mouse working. Finally decide to replace the battery, find the right battery and insert. Aha, now I have a working mouse.
Walk out onto the back deck and fall on my ass again as their is a sheen of ice on everything. Go in, turn on the hydraulics and hose down the deck with the two inch pacer pump hose. After about five minutes the ice is washed off the deck. Then I have to scrape all the ice off the windows. The ice scrapers are in the truck. I try two spatulas before I find one that works. Climb up on the bow and sides of the boat to scrape the windows. Go back in and my breath promptly condenses on the windows. So I need to open the sliding window to let the cabin breathe. Only the sliding windows are iced shut. Go back to the two inch hose and wash all the windows with salt water (in retrospect I should have done this instead of the scraping). Go in and dry off the port passenger seat where the water sprayed in as that window was open a crack.
Check throttle and shifter which are a bit stiff from the cold but work fine. Decide to go untie the boat. The lines are frozen from the coating of the rain and the freezing. I go get a big screwdriver and pry the lines off the cleats. While untying I notice that I have not rethreaded the fairlead onto the starboard tip wire from when I ran the float bag into the block last trip (which is another story). Rethread fairlead and untangle tag lines. Climb onto boat and ease out of the harbor.
Decide to set the poles for fishing. The haul up lines are frozen, repeat process with screwdriver to free from cleats. Try to push pole out, the stay downs and blocks are all frozen. But, after some grunting and colorful language I get the port pole out. The pin to secure the staydown is frozen onto the top of the cabin. I find a gaff hook and with a good whap it comes free. The starboard pole does not want to budge. I take the boat out of gear and let the boat roll in the slight swell to give me some help. I turn on the salt water hose again, man I love that two inch stream of saltwater, and hose down the staydown and the closest block. A bit of cool saltwater ricochets onto me but I hardly notice since I am already steaming in more ways than one. With the roll of the boat and the thawed rigging I manage to get the starboard pole out also. After a quick survey and note that it was nearly two hours ago when I left the house I charge toward the fishing grounds.
It is fairly nice in Eastern Channel and about four guys are dragging around. But, I decide to head out, late as I am, for the winter line. I keep an eye out for birds or whales or schools of feed on the color sounder. Nothing of interest. It is a nice ride out tuned into serius 122 college football talk which is mostly about my Alma Mater, Oregon (class of 72) playing Auburn in the NCAA national championship game. One highliner at Vitskari but no one else between Eastern Channel and about 5 guys on the line.
Go out to set the gear. It is windy out there, and cold. Set the gear with the usual headaches of tangles etc. Spend about 10 minutes fixing the starboard float bag which is deformed from being run into the block. Re-splice the starboard wire which was not done to perfection while retrieving it and the float bag last time out. Froze up pretty good by the time I get back into the cabin which is pretty toasty by now. Troll around to the winter surf line and head back toward town as it is getting windier out of the nor-east. Beautiful day with the sun on the volcano topped with fresh snow and the snow capped mountains behind town. Go run gear and put out the new lure concoction which I have high hopes for. Nothing so far which leaves me to wondering if the electrical short has screwed up my electrical field.
Troll in toward town as the wind comes up. 122 goes to the darn show with the guy from Alabama who is not too "impressed" with my ducks. Fire up the iPhone and play a couple of rounds of scrabble and lexulous with my online partners, who are all beating me today. Wonder if that bounce and vibration on the port tip is a fish. Go out and go through all the gear for nothing. Come back in and warm up. Somehow I got bad cream in my coffee so I throw out the rest of the thermos. Starting to roll around a bit as the wind is up over 20 now. Pick up various items that have rearranged themselves to the floor. Change the serius channel to news. Quickly decide I don't want to hear about the Republicans taking control of Congress. Change to some rock and roll, classic vinyl. Play "trolling" on my scrabble board for a pretty good score and impression on my playing partner.
Decide I have had enough of the wind and go stack the gear, barely avoiding a big clump of macrosystis on the port side as I haul the starboard side. Nothing on the gear. Run in with spray flying and more stuff rearranging. Have a brief moment of panic when I notice a deadhead going under the bow. Quick grab for the throttle and clutch to glide over in neutral. One thunp and then clear, no harm. Notice that it is real nice in Eastern Channel and 5 guys are still fishing which means they probably caught something while I was out wandering around in the wind for nothing.
Wife reminds me we have a dinner date and I have only about 5 minutes of hot tub time before getting dressed for the skiff ride to their place. Dinner date includes a guy who fished Eastern Channel all day and caught "something".

So, there you go, another skunk day winter trolling. So far I am skunked for December and January. Living on Christmas goodies.

[Super Cub]

Thanks for the input so far. And thank you "Salty" for a great read. I'm not sure my Mustang suit would make my boat comfortable in sub-freezing temps and 20kt wind.

I have read the permit total and percentile catch stats for SE, but I don't remember finding monthly landings; I'll do some more reading. I know this is a long-shot; I guess I'm just feeling desparate.

[ericv]

Supercub,
I have to second Salty's words of wisdom and rendition of what can be a "typical" day for us during the winter, his precise play by play detail is painfully accurate. I spent the day out yesterday in front of Sitka, other than crow barring my lines free for 20 minutes, I did not have as many ordeals as him - - this time. Winter trolling, especially after a rain and freeze requires extreme caution and a slowed down expectations. I spend a fair time handtrolling before switching to power. As many have noted on this great forum, a possible avenue to start is for example in a port like Sitka that has the infrastructure and facilities for both fishing and to have a primary job. However nice it may be, it can be a challenge to make year round wages solely as a handtroller, there are several here in town who do a masterful job at it and many of them do this as a secondary line of work. Possibly find a user friendly town, bring that great looking dory and find any type of full time work. For example here, folks who work in the food service industry usually get a price break for meals. Work at the hardware or marine store and you typically get some form of an employee discount etc. This little "perks" can help in lean times and possibly aid in expenses for the boat. Some jobs may not be glamorous or what we want to really do but at least in theory you should get 2 days off per week to venture out and troll. I have a full time day job that supports the fishing and maritime disease that is terminal in my body since birth and even then I contemplate daily if I need or should sell my dear boat and permit out of reality. This year I began winter king fishing (day trips, once per week if I'm lucky) after a few years away from it. I enjoy the solitude, the challenges and the occasional rush of a king or few. Yesterday and last Sunday found me delivering my catch by hand, without aid of wagon or handtruck, via pickup truck, to the fish plant to give you any indicators as to quantity. It is nice that the current dock price (at least last week) is $7.75lb for all colors of kings. Yesterdays king will pay almost exactly the expenses for the 42 gallons of #2 diesel that topped off the fuel in our troller and the 2 dozen "Detroit Diaper" oil absorbent pads I got on Saturday. I even saved the plant $7.75 in my honesty as I alerted the guy that the poke and gill cavern were packed with flake ice since he placed this fish on the scale without checking. if I was dishonest, that would have paid for the coffee, sardines and Sailor Boy Pilot Bread I consumed yesterday.The beauty of your dory (I hantrolled out of a 19' Carolina Dory) is you can handtroll the inner bays, channels and pinnacle patches close in, maybe just a spread or two or three to coax out one of those winter kings lurking quietly in the kelp or shallows. Don't get desperate, get focused and take small steps and don't hesitate to private message folks on this forum. As they say on the Red Green show, "remember, we're all in this together, keep your stick on the ice"

Eric F/V New Hope Sitka

[Salty]

OK guys, time to post the next winter king caught picture on here. I am thinking a nice king laying in the snow on deck might be a good winter photo. Or perhaps a nice red filet laying on the snow on the hatch cover.

Here is one of trolling in the snow.

Trolling in the snow at Vitskari.jpg (82.76 KiB) Viewed 34708 times

[Salty]

I would post a picture of a King I caught this winter except I didn't catch one yet. Well, since November anyway.

[Super Cub]

Thanks, Eric. I'm afraid the "real job" may be in my future. In fact, I'm testing right now for a govt job in Newport, Oregon, so that I can maintain my fishing addiction. Unfortunately, a new bill was just introduced this week to add a bunch of new marine reserves in Oregon like California did, which could severely limit nearshore possibilities here. You guys are lucky that Alaska recognizes the economic value of its fisheries.

[Salty]

This is a bit off of November June Troll but what the heck.

Truth be told I am a marine reserve advocate. I have spent most of my life as a conservationist. I helped found the Alaska Marine Conservation Council and worked in the winters for 6 years for them. I helped author the first Marine Protected Area as such approved by the North Pacific Fisheries Management Council off of Alaska in the 19-34 pinnacles reserve for lingcod and rockfish. Have you seen the reserves adopted off the Aleutians by the North Pacific Fisheries Management Council? Plus we have Glacier Bay National Park with hundreds of miles of protected marine waters where fishermen are being phased out.
I was invited to Port Orford, Oregon to work with fishermen on their proposal for marine reserves to help sustain their fisheries. I attended two conferences in Canada about marine reserve development. In my opinion fishermen need to be proactive about getting involved with the development of marine reserves so they help shape the boundaries, the rules, and the effects. For example: by being involved in the 19-34 reserve we were able to leave the area open to salmon trolling.
One of the issues with marine reserves is the boundary fisheries that develop. So you need boundaries that are enforceable, and follow natural divisions in existing fishing patterns. The people best able to define these boundaries are fishermen and scientists working together. You also need funding for enforcement and an education component so everyone understands the rules, boundaries, and hoped for effects.
Another challenge with marine reserves is to make sure they don't allow sport fishermen to pillage the reserve while commercial fishermen are locked out. New Zealand is a good place to look at for their marine reserve experience. Species specific reserves need to be considered in addition to reserves where all fishing is prohibited. Marine reserves that prohibit most activities but have exemptions for surf riders is an example of the detail that needs to be considered.
I am an advocate for spawning reserves for salmon for example. I believe every watershed from California to the Arctic should have some spawning sanctuary where once salmon reach that area they are no longer subject to fishing pressure. In SE Alaska, for example, once a king salmon is in fresh water there is no take allowed. So, all our fresh water streams are Chinook sanctuaries.

I spent dozens of hours looking at underseas video of sponge and coral beds off of Alaska while developing a video on the effects of bottom trawling on benthic habitat. In the case of bottom trawling my opinion is that the whole ocean should be a reserve and perhaps, after study, areas could be opened up to carefully observed and enforced bottom trawling for species we can't harvest with other methods.

It is 16 degrees and there are wind advisories and warnings up all over SE Alaska today. So, I am hunkered down making a post instead of fishing.

[Super Cub]

Salty-
I applaud your conservation efforts, and I believe that marine reserves make sense in some instaces. I don't know much about SE Alaska. I do believe that the reserves in Puget Sound were warranted and have been successful from what I've read. I also understand the need for them in overfished areas of California, as well as in other countries that have been overfished. However, the proposed reserves in Oregon are not based on any scientific need. We have several marine protected areas already, including one of the largest MPA's in the county (Stonewall Banks off of Newport) which was proposed and by fishermen to deal with our only two threatened groundfish stocks (Yelloweye and Canary Rockfish). Our ocean fisheries are extremely well managed, and previously overfished stocks are rebounding rapidly (Ling Cod is a shining example). The proposed marine reserves in Oregon are following California's example: Marine reserves on most productive reefs, bordered by severely limited MPA's, so the only areas legal to fish will be barren areas over sand / mud bottoms. I agree with some of your assertions (boundary fisheries and fresh water salmon protection); I'll address those in a minute.

There are several problems with the way things are progressing here. First, the only two species of groundfish off the Oregon Coast that are still considered threatened do not frequent or spawn in the shallow water found within 3 miles of our coastline. Second, these two species are rebounding rapidly and are being encountered much more frequently in sport bycatch in deep water ground fisheries (halibut, ling cod), but there are no current stock assessments. You see, prior estimates of abundance were based on landings; however, since they are no longer allowed as bycatch, and since major restictions have been placed on trawl fisheries, there is no hard data to compare. It is ironic how this plays out; since they thought the stocks of these fish were low in our area (prior stock assessments included all of Oregon, Washington, and California coast), they base our other fisheries on total number of encounters with the magical orange fish because of the mortality caused by barotrauma (major improvements to release techniques are greatly reducing this mortality, but that's another discussion). So, as these stocks increase, we run into more and more of them as bycatch, which closes other fisheries sooner (or manage using max-depth closures; we can't fish for any groundfish other than Halibut beyond 40 fathoms, and they reduce it to 20 fathoms once a certain number of yelloweye encounters occur).

[Super Cub]

(Continued from above):
Even though the fact that we are encountering more of these protected fish every year, the lack of recorded landings makes it look like their numbers are decreasing, so other fisheries can't be managed properly. This is the same statistical anomoly that led to the huge news stories a few years ago that said that every single fish in the ocean would be caught by 2030 or something like that (I can look up a citation to this flawed study if you need it).

Anyway, the marine reserves are being sold to the masses as being the only solution to "protect our fish from greedy fishermen so your grandkids can catch them too." If there was a word of truth in this, I would be supportive. However, as mentioned above, all of the species that are resident within 3 miles of our coast are either stable or growing. Current management is very proactive and successful without these reserves.

Another major issue with the proposed reserves is funding. As I mentioned earlier, we have approximately 20 MPA's along the coast already, but ODFW doesn't have funding to study them. Therefore, we don't have a baseline to determine the need or success of such programs. They also don't have the funding to study the proposed reserves to have a way to compare in the future whether or not they are successful.

Finally, since there is no scientifically defined need for the reserves in Oregon, any implementation should be done as an experiment with future assessment and the possibility of dissolving them if they are deemed ineffective. However, these are being forced on our coastal communities as permanent measures with no possibility of revocation. They say they are only trying to protect a small percentage of the coast, but the locations happen to be over the commercially viable reefs. The original charter said that they would not be implemented in areas that would affect local commerce, but one of the first two appoved sites takes out approximately 30% of the historic fishing area for the Depoe Bay charter fleet. Worse yet, the new bill takes out the requirement to allow input of the comunities affected and increase input from private conservation groups.

[lone eagle]

I think the push for reserves in Oregon was a whim of a former govenor. I don't want to speak for Port Orford but from what I see fisherman were very much involved in the process which resulted in the reserve being placed well away from Orford reef and trolling and crabbing grounds.

[Super Cub]

(Continued from above):
Your example mentioned being able to troll in the reserve areas; the proposed marine reserves here won't allow any extractive uses. In fact, they are trying to close all access for non-extractive uses as well (in other words, not only will I not be able to fish over healthy reefs that my relatives have fished for years, I may not be able to scuba dive there to look at the pretty fish the reserve will supposedly protect). The marine reserves will be surrounded by MPA's that allow some fishing uses. Here is a link to the Cascade Head Marine Reserve that illustrates the way they will work: http://www.ifish.net/board/showthread.p ... t=reserves (that site has extensive discussion on Oregon marine reserves; from the "salty dogs" page on ifish.net, search for "reserves"). In otherwords, their stated goal of 10-14% of the coastline being a network of reserves will actually cover 30-50% of the coastline once MPA's are considered, and they will only be in productive fishing areas.

You mentioned that the reserves can cause increased size and abundance of fish just outside the borders of the reserves, which is logical. However, they will encourage overfishing of these border fisheries and all other open reefs by squeezing all fishing activities into a smaller area. This will likely eventually cause landings to indicate lower abundance in the open areas as well as decreased size of landed fish, and this will in turn be used to further close fishing opportunities. I know this may sound like a conspiracy theory, but it is all true.

As for salmon, the reserves will do nothing to protect them. We all know that salmonids migrate, and that they don't spawn offshore. Our wild coho have rebounded tremendously based on the Oregon Coho Plan, and great strides are being made in habitat enhancement for chinook. I have been heavily involved in salmon conservation, and the only things that will help are further freshwater projects, reduced harvest of baitfish, and (you're not going to like this...) reduced commercial catch in Alaska and Canada (approx 80% of some Columbia River Chinook species are caught commercially in Alaska and Canada). Reserves won't help salmon at all.

[Super Cub]

I think the push for reserves in Oregon was a whim of a former govenor. I don't want to speak for Port Orford but from what I see fisherman were very much involved in the process which resulted in the reserve being placed well away from Orford reef and trolling and crabbing grounds.

You are partially correct about the governor issue. Unfortunately, the "new governor" is actually the one that started the process when he was governor (he retired for two terms then just came back). You are also correct that the southern oregon reserve took the local fishing community's need into account better than the Cascade Head reserve (see link above). Besides affecting the charter fleet from Depoe Bay (approx 12-15 miles south), the Cascade Head reserve is in the traditional fishing grounds of the local dory fleet (one of the only small boat fisheries still active in Oregon; Pacific City is the most famous of this type).

I'm sorry to have totally hijacked my own thread, but this is really important to our coastal communities, and it is being forced on them by people with no stake in fishing or the local economies. This is prevalent in most of Oregon's politics; most of the population is in Portland, and they pass bills based on feel-good propaganda with no understanding of the implications to the rest of the state. A good example is when they banned cougar hunting with hounds and baiting bears with one state law. We now have severe predator problems, rapidly declining big game numbers, and ODFW is having to hire hound hunters to try to reverse the problem. I am a huge supporter of conservation measures that are scientifically supported; I just have trouble with seat of the pants environmental causes de jour being pushed by the barrista crowds that have never set foot in the woods or on the ocean.

[Salty]

Wow, an informed, passionate, articulate post well worth reading and thinking about. Thank you so much. Reminds me why it is so important to be involved both locally and politically. That being a successful troller means that the politics of your fishery are at least as important as engine maintenance.
I hear what you say about the lack of research funding being a problem. I know in the example of the 19/34 pinnacle that in the 5 years I dingle-barred lingcod on that site before others finally figured it out my catch was almost exclusively very large feeding females. Because Lingcod are cannibalistic it appeared to me that the smaller males avoided the site. Thus it was not a spawning or nursery area. Nevertheless, one of the big reasons cited by scientists for protecting the area was because it was a "spawning, nesting site". To this day we have not had any follow up research to prove either hypothesis.
You mention diving to view the marine life. One of the offshoots of protecting the area is that divers now commonly go out and view the lingcod, rockfish, etc. on the site. It is very impressive with video and pictures of lingcod stacked like cord-wood two and three deep. I can't imagine any harm.
Finally, I have looked at hundreds of salmon harvest statistics over the years, and while there may have been some stream in Puget Sound somewhere, sometime, when the combination of Canadian and Alaska troll fisheries caught 80% of the harvested Chinook, I don't think you will find that is the case now. In fact with Alaska being cut 15% of the Chinook Treaty, and good recent ocean Chinook survivals, I believe the Alaska troll harvest of Washington and Oregon Chinook is likely at historic low percentages. What is likely more damaging to Chinook runs in Oregon than the few Alaska Trollers catch is the practice of catching spawning female Chinook in the rivers, stripping their eggs for steelhead bait, and discarding the carcass. I have personally floated the Siletz river and observed this disgusting behavior. In SE Alaska we outlawed the use of bait for trout fishing years ago. (Bait, salmon eggs, are allowed in a fall window because the Territorial Sportsman in Juneau argued they couldn't catch coho without using salmon eggs.)
Anyway it is still howling northerly around SE Alaska with the temps in the teens or lower. I imagine any Oregon Chinook in the area is safe from troll harvest today.
Thanks again for the detailed, informative post. Fishery management is so complex, area and species specific, that it is amazing we do as well as we have. The experiential voice and wisdom of the fishermen is so crucial to the successful understanding of the resource. I worry, as you do, that this voice is being overwhelmed.

[Super Cub]

Salty- Thanks again for the good discussion. I didn't mean to imply that SE trollers were the scourge of our salmon stocks. A big part of the harvest problem is the bycatch in the Pollock fishery. Plus, the ocean harvest would seem insignificant if we could control some smolt predation issues here. Dredge pilings from the Columbia River channel formed islands that hold two species of birds that eat the majority of our outgoing smolts, and these birds are federally protected, so we can't eradicate them (Caspian Terns and Crested Cormorants).

I also agree that there are freshwater harvest problems here. The "egg hunting" that you described is being watched closely. First, it is illegal to take the eggs without retaining the whole fish, and sportfishermen are beginning to police themselves on this. Also, I don't know how far up the Siletz you were, but ODFW takes the eggs out of many of the surplus hatchery returns and then places the carcasses upstream to increase nutrient levels in the rivers. I'm not sure if what you saw were left by egg poachers or purposely by ODFW bios.

You are absolutely right that fishery management issues are complex. Unfortunately, Oregon's fishermen can't seem to agree on anything, so nothing ever seems to get done. One group is focused on dam removal, another is focused on commercial harvest reform, and others are focused on recreational harvest reform. Remember, "A man's best friend is his dogma!"

[Salty]

I love the wise man that realizes important ingredients to getting his story read are humor, tension, and sex. Of course it is only us salmon fishermen who appreciate salmon sex. I think you had all three in your last one. It was 1982 when I floated the Siletz. Good point, I saw about a dozen Chinook carcasses with the eggs stripped but do not know if they were hatchery recycled.
David Brooks has a great article (I read Republican articles also) "Tree of Failure" in the New York Times. Go to the most e-mailed on the right of the page to find it easily. It talks about dealing with dogma, including our own

[matthewrich]

Hey your super cub looks great, Loved to read your introduction. That's are lots of fishers there in your region, so while fishing if you caught any salmon they what are your doing, I would just like to know. I also love fishing but Pacific Salmon density is decreasing and that's why I fish no more.